Monday, June 28, 2010

Paul Krugman sees Depression is inevitable

I am taking the unusual step to add here the Op Ed piece of Paul Krugman writing in the NY Times. I have been telling my readers we are headed for a big drop in the markets of cataclysmic proportions. Now Paul Krugman uses the word DEPRESSION in his article, not as a passing comment about the 1930's, but rather, where we are headed. Here are his own words:

OP-ED Ccolunist
The Third Depression
By PAUL KRUGMAN
Published: June 27, 2010

Recessions are common; depressions are rare. As far as I can tell, there were only two eras in economic history that were widely described as “depressions” at the time: the years of deflation and instability that followed the Panic of 1873 and the years of mass unemployment that followed the financial crisis of 1929-31.

Neither the Long Depression of the 19th century nor the Great Depression of the 20th was an era of nonstop decline — on the contrary, both included periods when the economy grew. But these episodes of improvement were never enough to undo the damage from the initial slump, and were followed by relapses.

We are now, I fear, in the early stages of a third depression. It will probably look more like the Long Depression than the much more severe Great Depression. But the cost — to the world economy and, above all, to the millions of lives blighted by the absence of jobs — will nonetheless be immense.

And this third depression will be primarily a failure of policy. Around the world — most recently at last weekend’s deeply discouraging G-20 meeting — governments are obsessing about inflation when the real threat is deflation, preaching the need for belt-tightening when the real problem is inadequate spending.

In 2008 and 2009, it seemed as if we might have learned from history. Unlike their predecessors, who raised interest rates in the face of financial crisis, the current leaders of the Federal Reserve and the European Central Bank slashed rates and moved to support credit markets. Unlike governments of the past, which tried to balance budgets in the face of a plunging economy, today’s governments allowed deficits to rise. And better policies helped the world avoid complete collapse: the recession brought on by the financial crisis arguably ended last summer.

But future historians will tell us that this wasn’t the end of the third depression, just as the business upturn that began in 1933 wasn’t the end of the Great Depression. After all, unemployment — especially long-term unemployment — remains at levels that would have been considered catastrophic not long ago, and shows no sign of coming down rapidly. And both the United States and Europe are well on their way toward Japan-style deflationary traps.

In the face of this grim picture, you might have expected policy makers to realize that they haven’t yet done enough to promote recovery. But no: over the last few months there has been a stunning resurgence of hard-money and balanced-budget orthodoxy.

As far as rhetoric is concerned, the revival of the old-time religion is most evident in Europe, where officials seem to be getting their talking points from the collected speeches of Herbert Hoover, up to and including the claim that raising taxes and cutting spending will actually expand the economy, by improving business confidence. As a practical matter, however, America isn’t doing much better. The Fed seems aware of the deflationary risks — but what it proposes to do about these risks is, well, nothing. The Obama administration understands the dangers of premature fiscal austerity — but because Republicans and conservative Democrats in Congress won’t authorize additional aid to state governments, that austerity is coming anyway, in the form of budget cuts at the state and local levels.

Why the wrong turn in policy? The hard-liners often invoke the troubles facing Greece and other nations around the edges of Europe to justify their actions. And it’s true that bond investors have turned on governments with intractable deficits. But there is no evidence that short-run fiscal austerity in the face of a depressed economy reassures investors. On the contrary: Greece has agreed to harsh austerity, only to find its risk spreads growing ever wider; Ireland has imposed savage cuts in public spending, only to be treated by the markets as a worse risk than Spain, which has been far more reluctant to take the hard-liners’ medicine.

It’s almost as if the financial markets understand what policy makers seemingly don’t: that while long-term fiscal responsibility is important, slashing spending in the midst of a depression, which deepens that depression and paves the way for deflation, is actually self-defeating.

So I don’t think this is really about Greece, or indeed about any realistic appreciation of the tradeoffs between deficits and jobs. It is, instead, the victory of an orthodoxy that has little to do with rational analysis, whose main tenet is that imposing suffering on other people is how you show leadership in tough times.

And who will pay the price for this triumph of orthodoxy? The answer is, tens of millions of unemployed workers, many of whom will go jobless for years, and some of whom will never work again.

A version of this op-ed appeared in print on June 28, 2010, on page A19 of the New York edition.

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Tuesday, December 01, 2009

Mini Poll summary for November

I asked the same question I have been asking for over 8 months: "How long do you believe this recession will last?" The responses for November showed an increasing trend to a longer period of time than the first few months I asked the question. There were 56% of those responding who see us going into a Depression (28%), or see it will take longer than the choices I have provided (14%) or until 2012 (14%). The most frequent choice seemed to be that we are going to go into a Depression. There were 43 people who voted in the November Poll. We start all over again now for the month of December so please vote and only once in a month. Thanks. I will be putting together a chart of the results for the year in the beginning of January for 2009.

Here's the breakdown by choice.

1 End 2009 16%
2 Mid 2010 16%
3 End 2010 5%
4 Mid 2011 2%
5 End 2011 5%
6 Mid 2012 2%
7 End 2012 12%
8 Much longer 14%
9 Depression 28%


Here's a look at all the data:
Data for December, then January, February, March, April, May, June, July, August, September and November:

2009 39%, 42%, 34%, 33%, 29%, 18%, 9%, 16%, 9%, 11%, 16%
2010 30%, 23%, 16%, 21%, 48%, 34%, 23%, 19%, 16%, 19%, 21%
2011 20%, 17%, 20%, 6%, 8%, 8%, 12%, 9%, 2%, 12%, 7%
2012 0%, 0%, 4%, 3%, 2%, 26%, 29%, 33%, 46%, 11%, 12%
Much Longer than the choices you have provided 0%, 0%, 10%, 12%, 0%, 11%, 14%, 12%, 11%, 39%, 14%
Depression 12%, 19%, 18%, 24%, 13%, 4%, 14%, 10%, 18%, 8%, 28%*

* November was the highest month showing concern for a Depression. It is not conducive to a positive holiday Shopping year and increased Retail Sales.


Unemployment numbers coming out for the month of November on Friday. Mist experts and pundants belueve it will drop from 10.2% to 10.0% for November. We shall see.

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Wednesday, June 24, 2009

Market outlook for June 24th, 2009

This morning in pre-market Durable Goods Orders were reported to climb again 1.8% for May, as compared to a 1.8% gain in April. It is a very small positive sign, but the market is looking for any good news these days and a gain is better than a loss. The market may rise today but not a very strong rally in my view. The bigger news being awaited by the market is the announcement by the Fed after several days of meetings. Will Fed Chairman Bernanke say he still sees the worry of deflation or will they say they see and are concerned about inflation. In my view the Bulls and Bears will each have a strong case with whatever they say as a case can be made for being Bearish or Bullish. It doesn't really matter what they say. It is more important as to what the actual data says on the economy. So far, it's pretty bleak! If you are an American, Asian or European who is watching the data and see the Unemployment rate in the U.S. is at 9.4%, in California it's at 11.5% or in Spain it's 17%, you can say we are still in a bad recession. If you are one of those who are unemployed yourself, then you feel we are in a Depression!

But in pre-market the Futures are up and in Europe trading is up as well. Those views are by those who have money to invest and are obviously employed. They don't feel the pain of job loss! Only when the market goes down do most start to feel the pain of the reality of the economic conditions in their countries. Stay tuned!

Don't forget to vote in the Mini Poll on the right margin if you haven't voted this month. There is only 1 week left before I summarize June's data.

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Wednesday, April 01, 2009

March Mini Poll data summary: How long will recession last?

Here is a summary of the Mini Poll data for March as compared to December, January and February.

First the question.
How long do you believe this recession will last?

Data for December, then January, February and March:
Mid 2009 4%, 17%, 10%, 12%
End 2009 35%, 25%, 24%, 21%
Mid 2010 15%, 13%, 12%, 3%
End 2010 15%, 10%, 4%, 18%
Mid 2011 12%, 17%, 10%, 3%
End 2011 8%, 0%, 10%, 3%
Mid 2012 0%, 0%, 2%, 3%
End 2012 0%, 0%, 2%, 0%
Much Longer than the choices you have provided 0%, 0%, 10%, 12%
We are going to be in a Depression 12%, 19%, 18%, 24%

If I summarize by Year:
2009 39%, 42%, 34%, 33%
2010 30%, 23%, 16%, 21%
2011 20%, 17%, 20%, 6%
2012 0%, 0%, 4%, 3%
Depression 12%, 19%, 18%, 24%

Sample size for December was 26, for January 48 votes, for February 51 votes and for March 39 votes.

The largest change in the data showed that many now believe that we will go into a Depression.

Now March had one major voter voting more than once during the month and they voted for the Mid 2009. I took out the duplicate those duplicate votes in the data above.

I have cleared the data accumulated from the Mini poll so feel free anytime this month to enter again when you believe the recession will end. We can all see how the results change over time. I wish more would vote as with a bigger sample size it would become more statistically relevant but I am appreciative for those of you who do vote so thanks!

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Monday, March 02, 2009

February Mini Poll results on length of recession

Here is a summary of the Mini Poll data for February as compared to January & December.

First the question.
How long do you believe this recession will last?

December data for December,then January and finally February data:
Mid 2009 4%, 17%, 10%
End 2009 35%, 25%, 24%
Mid 2010 15%, 13%, 12%
End 2010 15%, 10%, 4%
Mid 2011 12%, 17%, 10%
End 2011 8%, 0%, 10%
Mid 2012 0%, 0%, 2%
End 2012 0%, 0%, 2%
Much Longer than the choices you have provided 0%, 0%, 10%
We are going to be in a Depression 12%, 19%, 18%

If I summarize by Year:
2009 39%, 42%, 34%
2010 30%, 23%, 16%
2011 20%, 17%, 20%
2012 0%, 0%, 4%
Depression 12%, 19%, 18%

Sample size for December was 26 and for January 48 votes and for February 51 votes.

The largest change in the data showed that many now believe that we will go longer than 2012 as we have gone from 0% to now 10% and many have now given up on ending this mid 2009.

Now February had a number of people voting more than once during the month and most voted for the End of 2009. If I take those out the data changes dramatically. Here's how it changes:

Timeframe Number of Votes and %
Mid 2009 2, 5%
End 2009 7, 17%
Mid 2010 5, 12%
End 2010 2, 5%
Mid 2011 5, 12%
End 2011 4, 9%
Mid 2012 1, 2%
End 2012 1, 2%
Much longer 5, 12%
Depression 9, 22%

If I summarize this scrubbed data by Year:
2009 39%, 42%, 22%
2010 30%, 23%, 17%
2011 20%, 17%, 21%
2012 0%, 0%, 4%
Depression 12%, 19%, 22%

This is a significant change over the raw data presented at the beginning of this post, especially as to the % of people believing we are headed for a Depression. It shows a steady increase in those who feel we are headed for a Depression and a significant reduction in those seeing it ending in 2009


I have cleared the data accumulated from the Mini poll so feel free anytime this month to enter again when you believe the recession will end. We can all see how the results change over time. I wish more would vote as with a bigger sample size it would become more statistically relevant but I am appreciative for those of you who do vote so thanks!

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Sunday, February 01, 2009

January Mini Poll results: When will the Recession end?

Here is a summary of the Mini Poll data for January as compared to December.

First the question.
How long do you believe this recession will last?

December datA followed by January data:
Mid 2009 4%, 17%
End 2009 35%, 25%
Mid 2010 15%, 13%
End 2010 15%, 10%
Mid 2011 12%, 17%
End 2011 8%, 0%
Mid 2012 0%, 0%
End 2012 0%, 0%
Much Longer than the choices you have provided 0%, 0%
We are going to be in a Depression 12%, 19%

If I summarize by Year:
2009 39%, 42%
2010 30%, 23%
2011 20%, 17%
2012 0%, 0%
Depression 12%, 19%

Sample size for December was 26 and for January 48 votes. Thanks for voting!


On January 3rd, in an earlier post, I came across the results of another poll with a similar but slightly different question. First the question and then the data with a link to that poll below.

Q. When do you think manufacturing will come out of recession?
mid 2009 6%
end 2009 41%
mid 2010 29%
end 2010 or later 23%

The results are comparable to my findings but a little more negative outlook. Here's the link to Industry Week website.

I have cleared the data accumulated from the Mini poll so feel free anytime this month to enter again when you believe the recession will end. We can all see how the results change over time. I wish more would vote as with a bigger sample size it would become more statistically relevant.

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Saturday, January 24, 2009

Yes We Can: How You can help turn the economy around.

That's right, "Yes We Can" collectively turn this economy around almost without even President Obama's help or that of the Congress. How can we do that? By having some faith that you truly can make a difference. Look, the economy is driven mostly by Consumer Spending, 70% to be exact. I know that about 10% of our citizens are unemployed, while many are currently worrying about their job security as well. But the 90% of us, who are employed, can help the country and our citizens by deciding not to stop our purchasing all together or eating in instead of going to a restaurant. Look around where you live and ask yourself if you want to see all the businesses close shop or restaurants go away. I don't. We can all turn this economy around, if we believe in our own power and spend again. I'm not saying spend with abandon, but what I am saying is to get back to a more normal and healthy lifestyle, rather than being so afraid.

Here's an example from my own experience. Our 12 year old refrigerator had a problem this past week. We were weighing whether we should get it fixed of buy a new one. We can think of good reasons for choosing either side of the choices. But when we add in the mix that it is good for the economy to buy a new one to help manufacturing jobs, to help a shipping company deliver it and a store that sells it, we have decided to buy a new one. Then the question is what to do with the old one? We have decided to give it away to someone, or charity, who might want it, or need it, or could get it fixed and use it, for another 12 years, as refrigerators have an expected life of 25 years.

Another example is choosing to eat out in some of our favorite restaurants. Every neighborhood has a favorite restaurant they take the family to or go to on a special evening. If those restaurants weren't there anymore, it wouldn't be the same living there any more. So choosing to go out to dinner helps support those restaurants keep surviving and helps those people who work there keep their jobs. Even some of the upscale restaurants, which have Valet parking service, can help a kid have a job.

The American people are a generous people and give freely to charity. We need to also think that charity also begins in our neighborhoods. We collectively can turn this economy around, but it starts with each of us as individuals deciding we are going to help President Obama with his most difficult job. When America is back the world will come back too. Right now they are scared too. Scarcity begets scarcity, but abundance begets abundance. Which mindset do you want to bring forth? Take accountability for getting out of this recession and preventing us from a Depression. Yes We Can!

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Monday, January 12, 2009

The morphing of language by President-Elect Obama's writers.

So I went to President-Elect Obama's transition page and saw a piece on the "deepening recession". Please do not use this language as it is easily morphed and reminds people of "Depression" The alliteration is too anxiety producing. Some suggestions you might try are the "worsening recession", or the "continuing recession" and you might try some messages which don't define the problem, but instead, give us some suggestions as to how we can help slow it down or reverse it. In those situations feel free to use some positive alliteration. Thanks!

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Tuesday, January 06, 2009

Paul Krugman warns us. Is anybody listening in Congress?

An article appeared today written by Paul Krugman of the NY Times and recent Nobel Laureate. I have taken the liberty to select portions of his piece and copy them below. It is must reading.

Krugman: Staving off a depression

By Paul Krugman

"If we don't act swiftly and boldly," declared President-elect Barack Obama in his latest weekly address, "we could see a much deeper economic downturn that could lead to double-digit unemployment." If you ask me, he was understating the case.

... Banks aren't lending; businesses and consumers aren't spending. Let's not mince words: This looks an awful lot like the beginning of a second Great Depression.

...It turns out, however, that preventing depressions isn't that easy after all.

The failure of monetary policy in the current crisis shows that Keynes had it right the first time. And Keynesian thinking lies behind Obama's plans to rescue the economy. But these plans may turn out to be a hard sell.

News reports say that Democrats hope to pass an economic plan with broad bipartisan support. Good luck with that.

In reality, the political posturing has already started, with Republican leaders setting up roadblocks to stimulus legislation while posing as the champions of careful congressional deliberation — which is pretty rich considering their party's behavior over the past eight years.

Here's my nightmare scenario: It takes Congress months to pass a stimulus plan, and the legislation that actually emerges is too cautious. As a result, the economy plunges for most of 2009, and when the plan finally starts to kick in, it's only enough to slow the descent, not stop it. Meanwhile, deflation is setting in, while businesses and consumers start to base their spending plans on the expectation of a permanently depressed economy — well, you can see where this is going.

So this is our moment of truth. Will we in fact do what's necessary to prevent Great Depression II?


If you want the entire article from the San Jose California Mercury News, click here.

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Wednesday, December 31, 2008

Dec. 31st Mini Poll Summary on Recession length

I decided to summarize the Mini Poll data since today is the last day of 2008. While the data has only been compiled since Dec. 26th when I started the Mini Poll. So here is the summary:

First the question:
How long do you believe this recession will last?

Mid 2009 4%
End 2009 35%
Mid 2010 15%
End 2010 15%
Mid 2011 12%
End 2011 8%
Mid 2012 0%
End 2012 0%
Much Longer than the choices you have provided 0%
We are going to be in a Depression 12%

If I summarize by Year:
2009 39%
2010 30%
2011 20%
2012 0%
Depression 12%

So after the New Year begins you can vote again and I will summarize January's data on January 31st and keep this going to measure the mood of those who voted. There were a total of 26 Votes in the past 6 days. Thanks for voting!

UPDATE Jan. 3, 2008
I came across the results of another poll today with a similar but slightly different question. First the question and then the data with a link to that poll below.

Q. When do you think manufacturing will come out of recession?
mid 2009 6%
end 2009 41%
mid 2010 29%
end 2010 or later 23%

The results are comparable to my findings but a little more negative outlook. Here's the link to Industry Week website.

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